[78-L] Some thoughts on J.J.Johnson

[Jeff Sultanof]

Julian,

My comments were directed at your reaction to an interview he gave, which I
tried to put in a different context which might cause readers of your
posting to look at them a bit differently, not to point out that he was
charming. I also used the opportunity to comment on his other talents in
case other readers of your post were not aware of what else he did.

I repeat: your opinion is your opinion, and you are certainly entitled to
it. Clearly you know Johnson's work based on your listening, so your
opinion has some interest to me, why I am responding. I think it is
interesting that you like certain of his recordings but point out that one
of them is weak. Maybe he had a bad day???? Recording sessions of big bands
were ended early because the band clearly was tired or the spirit to create
good recordings just wasn't there that day.

I, on the other hand, am very proud to know or have known many of my
heroes, primarily because it has helped me understand their art better when
I conduct it or teach it to students. The human element is still key when
dealing with an art form. For instance, it will always be fascinating to me
that Stan Getz, reportedly a really lousy human being, could create such
beautiful music.

Jeff Sultanof

On Sat, Nov 3, 2012 at 4:23 PM, Taylor Bowie <bowiebks at isomedia.com> wrote:

> Julian,
>
> You forgot to mention Joe Haymes in your list of pet dislikes...or have you
> come around on him?  :-)
>
> Taylor
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Julian Vein" <julianvein at blueyonder.co.uk>
> To: "78-L Mail List" <78-l at klickitat.78online.com>
> Sent: Saturday, November 03, 2012 1:18 PM
> Subject: Re: [78-L] Some thoughts on J.J.Johnson
>
>
> > Erwin,
> > I thought it was more than an opinion. I tried to argue a case for my
> > views. If I'd said "Johnson's playing leaves me cold" (which it doesn't
> > always), then that would have been an opinion. If I say "Johnson's
> > playing leaves me cold because...", then that's arguing a position.
> >
> > At least Johnson doesn't enter my list of pet dislikes: Bennie Moten,
> > Jimmy Rushing, Frank Sinatra and Ella Fitzgerald, all of whom I could
> > argue a case against--perhaps not very well. If I don't like a
> > performer, I need to find out why.
> >
> >       Julian Vein
> > ======================
> >
> > On 03/11/12 19:34, Erwin Kluwer wrote:
> >>   " His expressiveness was in inverse proportion to
> >> his technique."
> >>
> >> That's just your opinion....
> >>
> >> Erwin
> >>
> >>
> >> On Sat, Nov 3, 2012 at 7:12 PM, Julian Vein
> >> <julianvein at blueyonder.co.uk>wrote:
> >>
> >>> "I really cannot imagine what attracted me to the trombone. It's the
> >>> most ungainly, awkward, beastly hard instrument you can imagine."
> >>> (Interview with Mike Zwerin, 1999).
> >>>
> >>> This is pretty insulting to those trombonists who preceded him, who had
> >>> no difficulty negotiating their instruments to express their ideas and
> >>> feelings. Players like Miff Mole, Jack Teagarden, Tommy Dorsey, Joe
> >>> Nanton, J.C.Higginbotham, Dickie Wells, Floyd O'Brien, Al Leopold, Lou
> >>> McGarity, Jack Jenney, Bennie Morton etc. gave no hint of strain in
> >>> their playing. In other words, their technique was up to the task of
> >>> expressing what they had to say.
> >>>
> >>> While I like some of Johnson's work, a lot of it leaves me cold.
> >>> Although he wasn't a flashy player, he did seem to have more technique
> >>> than he really needed. A couple of other players who came on the scene
> >>> about the same time as Johnson--Bill Harris and Bennie Green--had
> >>> buckets' full of ideas. I suppose he wanted to develop sufficient
> >>> technique to keep up with the other boppers, but faster doesn't
> >>> necessarily mean better. His expressiveness was in inverse proportion
> to
> >>> his technique.
> >>>
> >>> Let's not make this a "shopping list" of trombonists I've omitted--they
> >>> were included as examples, not as a definitive list.
> >>>
> >>>        Julian Vein
> >>>
> >>>
> >
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