[78-L] Dates on AFRS transcriptions

[joe@salerno.com]

OK, that makes sense, now that you mention it....

joe salerno


David Lennick wrote:
> joe at salerno.com wrote:
>> Looking at my log. It looks like a combination of performances. Oberon 
>> Overture, Mahler #1 from Oct.21. Paganini Rhapsody & Onegin POlonaise 
>> from Oct 28.
>>
>> So another question - why bother? Why not just present the music as it 
>> was broadcast originally, since there was no intent to avoid repetition 
>> of the SVR Paganini? At least it answers my question about avoiding 
>> redundancy of the repertoire between AFRS & V-disc - there was no effort 
>> to do so.
>>
>> joe salerno
> 
> For starters, the AFRS Philharmonic broadcasts were an hour, not 90 minutes or 
> two hours..they'd have chopped wherever they could. Only the first two 
> movements of the Mahler were included, plus the Overture, Polonaise and 
> Rhapsody. Maybe they figured an AFRS audience would object less to getting half 
> a Mahler Symphony than half a Tchaikovsky.
> 
> The Ellington programs are just as chopped up, with items inserted from earlier 
> broadcasts or some later ones, sometimes unannounced..there are times when you 
> hear three different announcers in the same program.
> 
> dl
>>
>> David Lennick wrote:
>>> I've sent Joe the specifics off list, but the AFRS set is New York Philharmonic 
>>> Program #59, and the date on the discs is October *21* 1945, not October 28. So 
>>> which is it, I wonder? V-Disc Book says October 28th.
>>>
>>> dl
>>>
>>> joe at salerno.com wrote:
>>>> This ads more mystery to the thing. What AFRS set is it that contains 
>>>> the Kapell/Rodzinski?
>>>>
>>>> C'mon, you knew I was going to ask, for discographical purposes at least...
>>>>
>>>> joe salerno
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> David Lennick wrote:
>>>>> That's odd, because I HAVE the Kapell-Rodzinski Rhapsody on AFRS (and on 
>>>>> V-Disc)..they must have split the concert. I think there was half a Mahler 
>>>>> Symphony on the same set of discs. I sent Richard Rodzinski a copy, since he 
>>>>> didn't have this program.
>>>>>
>>>>> dl
>>>>>
>>>>> joe at salerno.com wrote:
>>>>>> Don't know about popular, but in the case of classical AFRS ET dates are 
>>>>>> MOSTLY correct, as far as I know. I've documented one instance in which 
>>>>>> they substituted material without a note on the date.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This instance was the Oct 28, 1945 performance of the Paganini Rhapsody 
>>>>>> with Kapell/Rodzinski/NYPS. This performance was issued on V-Discs. On 
>>>>>> the AFRS release of the same concert, the orchestral selections are 
>>>>>> there, but Kapell is nowhere to be found. For his portion they 
>>>>>> substituted the Strauss Burlesque with Arrau from a few weeks before. 
>>>>>> That additional date is not given in the run out, like anyone cared, nor 
>>>>>> does the announcer mention the fact that there was a different conductor 
>>>>>> for the Strauss on that other date, whose name I am not thinking of at 
>>>>>> the moment.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I have wondered if the AFRS & V-Disc producers cooperated in such 
>>>>>> matters to avoid redundancy in sending material to the troops, or if 
>>>>>> this was the decision of some conscientious program planner, or an 
>>>>>> accident. I've never encountered this any other instance, or known of 
>>>>>> some incident to check on.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Anyone else on the list know of such an occurence?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> joe salerno
>>>>>>
>>>>>> David Lennick wrote:
>>>>>>> When an AFRS transcription shows a date in the land, which other sources 
>>>>>>> confirm to be the original broadcast date, is it safe to assume that this may 
>>>>>>> have nothing to do with the actual date of cutting or dubbing? I've been 
>>>>>>> transferring several "Date with the Duke" programs, some of which show dates 
>>>>>>> and others showing "dubbed" (meaning pieced together from leftovers), but in a 
>>>>>>> couple of cases with dates, there are songs inserted which the band didn't play 
>>>>>>> till a couple of months later.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> (Related question: Did the AFRS producers have a bet to see how many times they 
>>>>>>> could insert the execrable Kay Davis massacring "Yesterdays"? I swear I've 
>>>>>>> heard it six times so far. What was the deal with her anyway..did she come out 
>>>>>>> naked?)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> dl
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