[78-L] Escott, was Arnold Covey

[Joe Scott]

Roughly half of all R&B of 1950 and 1951 had a backbeat. 1945 and 1946, virtually no one except Lionel Hampton, Buddy Johnson, and sessions by Hamp's sidemen such as Milt Buckner's late '46 session. The rise of backbeat in black music during 1947 on is, for one thing, why in '50s-'60s jazz recordings we have to listen to backbeats behind the likes of Lester Young even when it's supposed to be a swing session (sometimes they'd go with a subdued backbeat, which also had almost zero to do with 1929-1946 swing). Haley and the Treniers (who were friendly with each other early on) both got it from earlier people like Jimmy Preston, Roy Brown, Joe Turner, it was a normal part of this new fad sound Bill had taken an interest in after Joe (another friend of his, eventually) etc. already had.

Joseph Scott
----- Original Message -----
From: Cary Ginell
Sent: 03/07/14 10:23 PM
To: 78-L Mail List
Subject: Re: [78-L] Escott, was Arnold Covey

That's why it's not good to generalize when talking about rock 'n' roll. I just got a record by the Treniers of "Good Rockin' Tonight" and it's decidedly emphasizing the off-beat (2 & 4). Bill Haley's records were like that as well. This element could be found in western swing as well - the 2/4 beat that was made for dancing. Listen to any Chuck Berry record and you'll that as well. Cary Ginell On Mar 7, 2014, at 7:11 AM, Ron L'Herault <lherault at verizon.net> wrote: > I wonder too if there are subtleties of rhythm that changed. Jump bands > still swing from what I hear of them and rock bands tend to my ears to be > more 1-2-3-4 with little to no emphasis on any one particular beat. > > Ron L > > -----Original Message----- > From: 78-l-bounces at klickitat.78online.com > [mailto:78-l-bounces at klickitat.78online.com] On Behalf Of Mark Bardenwerper > Sent: Thursday, March 06, 2014 11:59 PM > To: 78-L Mail List > Subject: Re: [78-L] Escott, was Arnold Covey > > On 3/6/2014 9:01 PM, Cary Ginell wrote: >> It has more to do with the role the guitarist plays, in my opinion, vs. > tenor sax. Just having electric guitar in a group isn't the sole criteria. I > don't think it's possible to define what is rock n roll and what isn't and > have everyone agree. I listened to Rock This Joint by Preston and it still > sounds like R&B/jump to me. >> >> Cary >> > Can't help but agree with this in principal. Blues/R&B/jump had the same > rhythm and chord progressions going way back. > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gdZYayVhXVQ > I think it was almost entirely how it was marketed and brought into > prominence. We might easily agree that what we might recognize as rock > probably was being played somewhere before there were mikes around to record > it. And I think also it has to do with when it became acceptable to a larger > white audience through various means, possible taken on as a symbol of > independence to an emerging adolescent culture (read, James Dean). AND when > it supplanted the old dance music (though I remember every guy wanted to > "slow dance" with is favorite chick even in the 60's when I was a lad). > > -- > Mark L. Bardenwerper, Sr. > > Technology...thoughtfully, responsibly. > > Visit me at http://citroen.cappyfabrics.com > > _______________________________________________ > 78-L mailing list > 78-L at klickitat.78online.com > http://klickitat.78online.com/mailman/listinfo/78-l > > _______________________________________________ > 78-L mailing list > 78-L at klickitat.78online.com > http://klickitat.78online.com/mailman/listinfo/78-l > _______________________________________________ 78-L mailing list 78-L at klickitat.78online.com http://klickitat.78online.com/mailman/listinfo/78-l