[78-L] Is it really rarest blues record?, or, Troubled earth

Erwin Kluwer ekluwer at gmail.com
Wed Aug 28 12:03:04 PDT 2013


Patton influence has been a slow and has been for the most of the
century (say from1910 to 1950) largely an underground force...

A man who influenced a Robert Johnson, Muddy Waters, Howling Wolf
directly (all of them a huge impact on music by themselves)  simply IS one
of the biggest forces  in 20th century music....

Modern rock can't be imagene e without his sound, feel,  overal shape and

These people were indeed not selling the most records or were popular with
a more mainstrain audience... but commercial succes in art has always
showed a limited correlation with importance....

(BTW only ones that come close in terms of importance from the blues( a
wrong tem actually in terms of the meaning and actual musical content of
these muscicians)corner  are Blind lemon and maybe Lonnie Johnson....


On Wed, Aug 28, 2013 at 7:54 PM, Joe Scott <joenscott at mail.com> wrote:

> Hi Erwin,
> The Patton-like general sound hasn't been nearly as influential on music
> more generally as we often see claimed. Howlin' Wolf was certainly very
> influenced by it (although the widely praised use of distortion by his
> guitarists, for instance, was in fact preceded by its routine use in the
> most popular R&B band of 1950, Johnny Otis's California-based band, which
> might have something do with Wolf recording "California Boogie" in 1951).
> B.B. King has pointed out that the musicians he admired most weren't from
> the Delta, and of course he indeed doesn't sound like Patton. The biggest
> sellers of the '30s in blues such as Lonnie Johnson, Tampa Red, Leroy Carr,
> Kokomo Arnold, and Bill Broonzy, participants in the boogie fad such as
> Albert Ammons, and swing bands more generally such as Count Basie's were
> the biggest influence on the jump blues sounds of Louis Jordan, Roy Milton,
> T-Bone Walker, and their peers, who were in turn the biggest influence on
> very late '40s and early '50s rock
>   and roll such as Wynonie Harris's, Jimmy Preston's, Roy Brown's, Big Joe
> Turner's, and Bill Haley's -- which all had little to do with the likes of
> Muddy Waters. (Even Eric Clapton's sound was more influenced by the Texan
> Freddy King than by the Patton-like sound.)
> Joseph Scott
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Erwin Kluwer
> Sent: 08/27/13 03:02 PM
> To: 78-L Mail List
> Subject: Re: [78-L] Is it really rarest blues record?, or, Troubled earth
> It sounds pedestrian to you because this sound has been totally
> absorbed/assimilated by music as it's know today... On Tue, Aug 27, 2013 at
> 10:07 PM, Joe Scott <joenscott at mail.com> wrote: > Hi Mike B, you wrote: >
> > "... what I find interesting is the Willie Brown record that does exist >
> and is posted. > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_WREOMLH2u >
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_WREOMLH2uI I > It seems very pedestrian
> and ordinary to me, not like what is said in the > article that nobody can
> play in his distinctive guitar style." > > Everybody who sounds the most
> like Charlie Patton is the most > "distinctive." Now do you understand?
> Alan Lomax wrote in 1947 that the > "Mississippi Delta" was the "great dark
> valley of the blues... where the > earth and the people are equally fertile
> and burdened with troubles," if > that helps. > > Joseph Scott >
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