[78-L] Use of double bass in dance bands

[Jeff Sultanof]

Doug,

Which Retrieval reissue was this? I'd rather pick up the CD.

Thanks,
Jeff Sultanof

On Sun, Oct 28, 2012 at 8:42 PM, Doug Pomeroy <audiofixer at verizon.net>wrote:

> We've been on this thread for a long time now and all
> I can add, speaking as a recording engineer, is that the
> acoustic energy produced by the string bass is a fraction
> of that by brass bass, and this is the main reason records
> used the latter as frequently as they did, all other things
> being equal.  I realize others have pointed this out.
> As multi-miking became more common,
> starting in the late 20's (listen closely to the Red Hot
> Peppers' "Doctor Jazz"), the way to get the string bass
> loud enough was still was to put it on a riser near the
> main microphone (there is a photo taken at an Ellington
> session which shows this - and just listen to his "Hot And
> Bothered" on Okeh from 1928, in which the bass is the
> loudest and most "present" thing on the whole record!)
> but very soon thereafter it was normal to give the string
> bass a separate mic at his normal place in the rhythm section.
>
> I think Ellington wanted the string bass because it sounded
> more "modern" than brass bass at that time, and electrical
> recording made it possible for the first time to really hear it.
> I think this was a "selling point" for early electrical recordings;
> even Gennett got on the bandwagon with its "Walkin' The
> Dog" by Carmichael's Collegians in 1928.
>
> I cannot resist mentioning a reissue I recently acquired
> (on Retrieval label) which includes some really fine
> brass bass playing by Henry Edwards, including some
> perfectly executed sixteenth notes, with Noble Sissle's
> Orch on HMV B 5731, "Kansas City Kitty" from 1929.
> Anyone who wants to hear it, let me know and I'll send
> you an mp3.  It's a gasser and it gets hotter (and louder)
> as the performance progresses.
>
> Doug Pomeroy
> Audio Restoration & Mastering Services
> audiofixer at verizon.net
> ========================================
> > Message: 7
> > Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2012 12:11:09 +0000
> > From: David Lewis <uncledavelewis at hotmail.com>
> > Subject: [78-L]  Use of double bass in dance bands
> > To: 78-l <78-l at 78online.com>
> > Message-ID: <BAY156-W12994ED64DB8D79C419CB9CC7C0 at phx.gbl>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
> >
> >
> > Belated response to this thread, and apologies for that. My experience
> has been, and that comes from merely from listening to lots and lots of
> dance records from 1918-34, is that while the brass bass dominates before
> 1928 both brass bass and string bass are used interchangeably inthis whole
> period. There are very early dance records from around 1920 that use bass
> clarinet or bassoon in that role as well. And the brassbass doesn't
> necessarily disappear from the scene after 1928; witness this Fletcher
> Henderson recording from 1931: https://www.box.com/s/f6hiw1l0crf83tm60jv7It seems most bass players in jazz/dance bands in that period were capable
> of playing both, much as a saxophone player in the 1920s wasexpected to
> know clarinet too, and several kinds of saxophones and if needed, other
> reeds such as oboe. If there was a conscious transitionfrom brass bass to
> string bass, and I'm not sure that it was "conscious" per se, before that
> it was up to the player or arranger to det
>  er
> > minewhich option sounded better within a given piece. Vince Giordano is
> the bassist in the Nighthawks and he crams into his little spot on
> the'stage at the Edison Hotel a bass sax, tuba and a metal string bass. You
> do see similar configurations in old photos of dance bands; I reallythink
> it was up to the discretion of the player. Possibly the pluckier sound of
> the string bass "won" by 1935 simply because it fit better with the tempo
> of swing music, but note that in theHenderson file the brass bass has no
> trouble swinging this chart. I play the electric bass regularly and I can
> attest, yes, if you are a bassplayer it is easy to detect mistakes in the
> bass line. But the upside of that is that you can better appreciate really
> outstanding bass playingwhen it happens.
> >
> > Uncle Dave Lewis
> > uncledavelewis at hotmail.com
>
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