[78-L] 78 album covers (was Album Covers & Sleeve info) (was: Alex Steinweiss article)

[Michael Biel]

People keep unnecessarily changing the subject line instead of replying
to the exact same subject line and this is creating havoc.  This
discussion about the Steinweiss article is in five threads right now. 
Lets get them back to THIS one, OK?


-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Re: [78-L] 78 album covers
From: "Ted Kneebone" <tkneebone1 at abe.midco.net>
>>> I am not sure what date is being used when writing about about the
>>> creator of the first illustrated album covers. 

 Michael Biel wrote:
> Neither do the authors of the articles, web sites, and books. Many are
> just using a 1938 date which is impossibly early for a red label
> Columbia C-11. I think it is mid 1940, finding that RELEASE date is
> important.

>>> 5. Record companies of the day seemed to want to hide dates from
>>> the consumers. I don't think I have a single record, album, or
>>> sleeve with a date.

Those of us with large collections do.  Decca had a copyright date on
their album cover designs for much of the 1940s, and even used different
dates for the different speed issues of the same design.  For
example,the original LP (which I have in front of me) of Carousel has a
1949 copyright date on the LP cover, but of course the 78 had come out
years earlier with the same cover design and the earlier date.  Many
sleeves and booklets had printing dates, and back in the early
acoustical days some had patent info license effective dates.  Columbia
had a two-letter code for the printing dates of the labels for about
three years in the late teens, and this has been discussed here several
times.  Gennett put release dates on their records for several years in
the 20s and this was discussed here a week or two ago.  The later Hit of
the Week records and some of the mid-30s ARC labels had their release
dates encoded in the record numbers.  

Almost all record companies issued monthly release booklets given out in
record stores and annual catalogs.  This is what we use for guiding us
to release dates.  While none of us have anywhere complete collections
of these monthlies and annuals, many of us have some of them, and that
is why I ask on the list for someone to find the release dates.  If it
is not in one catalog but is in the next, we can interpolate the date or
hope that someone will come up with the monthly that lists it as a new
release. 

> LP era didn't change that. That really frustrated me in my duties as
> cataloger of LPs at Northern State. The printed LC cards had dates. I
> don't know where the LC librarians found the dates. 

Several ways.  One is knowing about these catalogs and monthly booklets.
 Another is looking thru Billboard, Cash Box, Record World, and other
trade press that gave new release lists every week.  In the LP era there
was the new release sections in Schwann, The Long Player, Jazz and Pops,
One Spot, Phonolog, H. Royer Smith's The New Records, and other monthly
or weekly catalogs.  And lastly, the Library of Congress gets copyright
submissions, and these are dated.  

> I think it was sometime in the late 1960s or early 1970s when dates
> started appearing on the versos of LP jackets. I don't recall ever
> finding dates on the record labels. 

>From 1972 on just about EVERY record ever issued in the U.S. has a (P)
phonogram copyright year.  In England the issue year was clearly
mentioned on labels going back into the 50s.  There is a mechanical
copyright date embossed into most records release in Germany going back
to the late 1920s.  

> The CD era changed all that. Most of my CDs have dates.

Check your post 1972 LPs.  They do too.

From: David Lennick <dlennick at sympatico.ca>
> >The individual discs are 35379/82. Gart shows 35393 as released in April 1940.

>> Victor launched their P-* album series around 1935-36; did these
>> come with "cover art," or did that show up later? Steven C. Barr 
 
> Yes they did have illustrated covers, but there were not too many of
> them before 1940. These and the Deccas are what I am trying to use as
> pre-Steinweiss examples -- so RELEASE date is what is important. 
> 
> Mike Biel mbiel at mbiel.com
 
> > Symposium of Swing (Victor C-28) had a designed cover and is
> > in the 1938 catalog. As with the Toscanini Beethoven 5th, 
> > I've never seen it with a plain cover..has anyone? dl

I think these are GREAT examples.  I wish I had my copies here with me! 
These give both pop and classical examples that show that Steinweiss was
a COPYCAT!!!!  While most classical albums did have plain covers, not
all of them did.  And most of the pop albums had illustrated covers. 
One of the contentions of the Steinweiss fans is that having cover
designs revolutionized the was records were DISPLAYED in the stores. 
BULLHOCKEYPUCKS!  There were album covers to display for years and years
and years before Steinweiss.  These people don't know what they are
talking about.  


> > And then once the LP era came along, both Columbia and Victor went
> > back to generic covers for many of their late 78 classical albums!

I don't see that in the U.S.  Maybe they did in Canada, but not here. 
What Victor often did was have a small 7 inch by 7 inch illustration
that was used for the 45 but was centered in the larger 10- or 12-inch
LP cover.  In the Eleanor Roosevelt Peter and the Wolf recording, the
only way to see that illustration in a 12x12-inch size is on the very
scarce 78 album.  It is 7x7 on the 10-inch LP.  Of course there were the
generic Columbia LP covers in 1948 but that was because they were doing
those releases VERY QUICKLY!!!  In fact, if you look at the two photos
of Peter Goldmark at the release press conference, they did not have the
10-inch covers ready and all the 10s are in white sleeves except for the
top one which is in a folded-over 12-inch sleeve.

> > Columbias began showing dates in tiny print on the front covers sometime
> > after the war, but these are copyright dates for the artwork.

I have not had a chance to compare later LP releases for Columbia like I
have for Decca.

> > Don't Decca's booklets often show a printing date?  dl

Yes.

Ted Kneebone wrote:
> In going thru part of my "collection" of 78s, I find both albums and
> sleeves.
>
> 1. Albums go from plain to very plain. Just the name of the work,
> performers, album number. My copy of the Bloch Concerto Grosso is brown and
> very plain, with gold stamping, Victor.
> 2. The Columbia albums are either blue or green with circles containing the
> info. And most of them are grey with info in a box. Very plain.
> 3. The sleeves are interesting. Acoustic sleeves sometimes have line
> drawings of the artist. On the back are lists of other records by same
> artist, or other artist. The acoustic sleeves are really quite interesting:
> type styles, line drawings of artists, line drawings of phonographs, etc.
> The electric era was boring in comparison.
> 4. The sleeves for electric discs say "Victor" or "Columbia" and on the
> reverse are long lists of other classical discs.

> 6. I have tried to scan some of my sleeves and albums, but for some reason
> I can't locate them on my computer when done scanning! Maybe I don't know
> how to use this new HP scanner. Think I will go back to my Acer.
>
> Ted Kneebone. 1528 S. Grant St., Aberdeen, SD 57401. Phone: 605-226-3344.