[78-L] Mascagni

Mon Dec 8 13:12:05 PST 2008

Actually Toscanini's Parsifal was one of the slowest around, and there are
more examples of his  like this...

There is also enough to support a lot of music was played quite bit faster
then we accustomed now, and slower for that matter.. It seems like in the
19th century there was even an wider and wilder variety in approaches then
we are familiar now... (which became gradually more  homogenized trough mass
media..)

Erwin
On Mon, Dec 8, 2008 at 8:59 PM, simmonssomer <simmonssomer at comcast.net>wrote:

> Toscanini probably was compensating for slowing down by speeding up. All
> geniuses can do that.
>
> Al Simmons
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Steve Abrams" <steve.abrams at gmail.com>
> To: "78L" <78-L at 78online.com>
> Sent: Monday, December 08, 2008 1:47 PM
> Subject: Re: [78-L] Mascagni
>
>
> > This doesn't make a great deal of sense, Al.  Mascagni may have slowed
> > down
> > (on this particular recording).  But you have forgotten that Toscanini
> > increased his tempos as he grew old!
> >
> > Also, there is a well known live recording of Cavalleria also conducted
> by
> > Mascagni in connection with the 50th anniversary. The tempos in this
> > performance are faster than those on the complete set.  Also, the tempos
> > in
> > the recording of L'Amico Fritz a year later are quite sprightly.
> >
> > It should be added, however, that Mascagni enjoyed himself hugely in
> > making
> > his recording of Cavalleria.
> >
> > Zucker has recently circulated Gino Bechi's memories of the recording
> > sessions:
> >
> > With his magical baton in his hand, Mascagni let himself fly on the wings
> > of
> > music, to a better world, where discs, clocks and commercial necessity
> > didn't exist; he laughed at technical needs....He put on a pair of new
> > shoes
> > that at his smallest movement went cri-cri, causing the session to come
> to
> > a
> > halt. The producer said to him, "Excuse me, Maestro, but you know that
> > every
> > outside noise gets recorded, and your shoes are creaking. So as not to
> > ruin
> > the recording, you need to try to stand still."
> >
> > "What, my shoes," responded Mascagni. "The cri-cri isn't good? That's
> what
> > you think! I'm adding it to the orchestra as a supplementary sound. We're
> > in
> > the country, and in the country the sounds of crickets are a good
> > thing."...
> >
> > When we recorded the duet with Bruna Rasa, we sang the first take really
> > well, synchronised--fused with the orchestra--a masterpiece. When the
> last
> > note finished we were waiting for the red light to go off, when Mascagni
> > exclaimed, "Bravi, benissimo, I'm really happy"--and he clapped his hands
> > like a child. We had to do it over again.
> > After we had repeated the thing a zillion times for musical reasons or
> > because the wax of the matrix broke, we thought we finally had brought it
> > into port when, with the red light still lit, Mascagni declared,
> > "Obviously
> > we've got it"--and everything was ruined. [Translated from Daniele
> > Rubboli:
> > Gino Bechi: il palcoscenico e la vita (Bologna: Bongiovanni Editore,
> > 1988),
> > p. 100ff.]
> >
> > Perhaps I should add that the Naxos transfer of Cavalleria on two CDs is
> > filled out with a number of examples of orchestra music conducted by
> > Mascagni.
> >
> > I find Mike Richter's comments to be ignorant and arrogant. Richter says
> > that Mascagni's records (from the '30s and '40s are too primitive "to
> > indicate much if anything."  This does not stop him from drawing
> > conclusions
> > about
> > Caruso and Leoncavallo (on piano) performing together in 1904.
> >
> > Richter asserts there is dispute about whether Mascagni actually
> conducted
> > the recording of Cavalleria.   This reminds me of his preposterous claim
> > in
> > another place that much of the premiere of Turandot in April, 1926 was
> > recorded.  He says "The boxes were mismarked and the matrices were
> > destroyed."  He also asserts wrongly that none of the principals ever
> > recorded anything from the opera which has survived.
> >
> > For the record, there were live recordings of excerpts from Turandot at
> La
> > Scala in November 1926 and these were issued.  (Four choruses conducted
> by
> > Panizza.) The soprano Zamboni recorded both of her arias, and two of the
> > three creators of "Pang" and "Pong", Nessi and Venturini recorded the
> long
> > trio with Baracchi (who sang the Mandarin at the premiere.
> >
> > Steve Abrams
> >
> > ___________________________________________________________________
> > Message: 13
> > Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2008 10:30:03 -0500
> > From: "simmonssomer" <simmonssomer at comcast.net>
> > Subject: Re: [78-L] Mascagni.
> >
> > The older one gets, the faster things we see and hear around us seem to
> > move. This causes us to slow down. It's true of driving a car. I'm not
> > sure
> > about leading an orchestra. But it makes an interesting theory.
> > Oh Mama!
> >
> > Al S.
> >
> > Message: 16
> > Date: Mon, 08 Dec 2008 08:07:53 -0800
> > From: Mike Richter <mrichter at cpl.net>
> > Subject: Re: [78-L] Mascagni.
> >
> > Spats wrote:
> >> Hi!
> >>
> >> If that's the tempo that the composer himself wanted, then that's the
> >> correct tempo, it seems to me. Forget the critics!
> >
> >
> > Bah, humbug!
> >
> > There is no rule dictating that a composer must be a capable or even a
> > competent conductor. Richard Strauss was considered superb though the few
> > examples recorded do not show that consistently. But Mascagni was
> > recording
> > early enough that one cannot rely on what was captured to indicate much
> of
> > anything. In addition, there is argument over his role in the recording
> > which he may have "supervised" for publicity purposes rather than
> > conducted.
> >
> > It is also a fallacy to assume that the composer knows all that his
> > creation
> > offers. In some cases, such as Verdi's Simon Boccanegra and Macbeth, his
> > revisions are extensive and produce something close to a new work;
> > freezing
> > either in its original form would give us only an interesting but lesser
> > work. Why, then, would one assume that a recording by the composer or any
> > other indication of the balance, tempo, or style he preferred should
> rule?
> >
> > Leoncavallo accompanied Caruso in a recording of one of his songs. It is
> > an
> > intriguing document but fortunately we have versions with far better
> piano
> > playing and better agreement between singer and pianist.
> >
> > Again - in the spirit of the season - Bah, humbug!
> >
> > Mike
> > --
> > mrichter at cpl.net
> > http://www.mrichter.com/
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
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>
>
>
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