[78-L] film request for a silent 78 side

[joe@salerno.com]

Interesting that it is the BBC, and not Hollywood.

js


DanKj wrote:
> In an episode of Jeeves & Wooster (BBC), there's an Orthophonic Victrola playing a 
> Whiteman record, and it sounded authentic
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "joe at salerno.com" <jsalerno at earthlink.net>
> To: "78-L Mail List" <78-l at klickitat.78online.com>
> Sent: Monday, October 13, 2008 12:48 PM
> Subject: Re: [78-L] film request for a silent 78 side
> 
> 
>> OK, that's 2 for the visual channel.
>>
>> joe salerno
>>
>>
>> David Lennick wrote:
>>> They looked correct in "The Harmonists" but sounded awfully scratchy for what
>>> were supposed to be brand new Electrola pressings.
>>>
>>> I may have been incorrect about the machine in "Out of Africa" (can't remember
>>> whether it was external or internal) but not about the 70s LP on the turntable.
>>>
>>> dl
>>>
>>> joe at salerno.com wrote:
>>>> 99.99%? Really?
>>>>
>>>> I think that is optimiistic. (no pun intended, optical having been
>>>> discussed in regards to MOS)
>>>>
>>>> Has there EVER been a scene in a movie, excluding documentaries about
>>>> playing grammo records, that DOES accurately depict a record CU on
>>>> screen being played?
>>>>
>>>> Can anyone name even one?
>>>>
>>>> joe salerno
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> David Lennick wrote:
>>>>> If they were doing live television, that would make sense, but films are shot
>>>>> from various angles and takes are intercut, so the source music can't possibly
>>>>> be live from "the source".
>>>>>
>>>>> Even so, it's great (and unheard of) to find someone actually trying to get the
>>>>> right materials for a scene involving phonograph records, which are
>>>>> misrepresented 99.99 percent of the time. An external horn gramophone was seen
>>>>> in "Out of Africa", with a close-up of a record with an HMV label. A 70s LP.
>>>>>
>>>>> dl
>>>>>
>>>>> Chris Zwarg wrote:
>>>>>> At 21:14 12.10.2008, you wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Joe wrote,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I don't get it - just use any record
>>>>>>> Hmmm, Joe, nobody, seems to have understood what the film producer wants
>>>>>>> to do....
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The way I understand it, as she says there's a problem for the sound
>>>>>>> dept., she wants to film a needle being placed on a rotating 78, then
>>>>>>> the camera pans back to film the actors/dialogue, all in one take.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> So, they don't want music bellowing out from the gramophone while the
>>>>>>> actors speak (they will dub some quiet music in later).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Now do you see why they want a 'silent' 78 ?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> So, can anyone help the producer?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> John
>>>>>> IMHO, they should find a "suitably quiet" 78 with music fitting the mood of 
>>>>>> the scene, maybe put a "soft" or "pianissimo" needle on, and record dialogue 
>>>>>> AND music in the same take. This way, the music will actually sound like music 
>>>>>> coming out of a gramophone, which I presume is what they want to achieve - if 
>>>>>> that gramophone is not supposed to play music in the volume and tone quality 
>>>>>> such a machine will typically produce, the scene setup is somehow silly, isn't 
>>>>>> it? The "natural" volume of the gramophone music should be low enough that the 
>>>>>> actors can easily hear each other, so the sound recordist should have no 
>>>>>> problem to pick the dialogue up clearly; if OTOH the music is so loud as to 
>>>>>> mask the dialogue, that merely shows that the characters *could just not have 
>>>>>> been talking the way they do standing next to the machine, as they wouldn't 
>>>>>> have understood each other*, and they shouldn't try and film it that way, 
>>>>>> pretending the gramophone sounds more softly than it does.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Chris Zwarg
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